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Jul 10, 2015 08:29
8 yrs ago
8 viewers *
Spanish term

incluyendo y sin restricciones

Spanish to English Law/Patents Law: Contract(s)
Hi everyone,

I wonder if anyone can help me with the underlined part in the folllowing sentence:

La empresa no será responsable de ningún tipo de daños, incluyendo y sin restricciones, los daños, seguros, pérdidas debidas a fuego...".

The literal translation "including and without restrictions" doesn't make much sense to me. I had thought that the meaning was "including but not limited to..." but a native has told me that this is not the meaning.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Thank you!
Proposed translations (English)
5 +8 including but not limited to

Discussion

Jesstee Jul 10, 2015:
Being a native speaker and writer of both languages I would understand by this statement, that the company is not responsible for any kind of damages including but not restricted to the examples mentioned. Hope this helps.
Kerry Taylor (asker) Jul 10, 2015:
Thanks for the confirmation Jesstee. I guess it just goes to show what you're all saying-that not all native speakers can be trusted with this type of text!
Kerry Taylor (asker) Jul 10, 2015:
Philgoddard, the native speakers I consulted thought we were wrong because they said that it was the "seguros", the "pérdidas debidas a fuego", etc. that were "sin restricciones" as opposed to the list of examples.
Jesstee Jul 10, 2015:
"The company will not be held responsible for any damages, including but not limited to..." I'm a native speaker and this is the way I would understand said document.
Henry Hinds Jul 10, 2015:
Native Many native speakers unless appropriately educated have a problem understanding legal language, so their advice cannot be trusted.
philgoddard Jul 10, 2015:
Why do the native speakers you've consulted think we are wrong?
Kerry Taylor (asker) Jul 10, 2015:
Would it be possible for any native Spanish speakers to confirm the meaning please? Thank you!

Proposed translations

+8
16 mins
Selected

including but not limited to

.

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Note added at 17 mins (2015-07-10 08:46:25 GMT)
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it IS the meaning

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Note added at 18 mins (2015-07-10 08:47:56 GMT)
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actually I put this in before seeing that you suggested it yourself

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Note added at 2 hrs (2015-07-10 10:35:51 GMT)
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I have probably read and translated more legal documents in Spanish than nearly any native Spanish speaker you are likely to meet.....

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Note added at 2 hrs (2015-07-10 10:39:32 GMT)
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I suggest you ask your native friends what they think it means then

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Note added at 8 hrs (2015-07-10 17:15:58 GMT)
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In fairness to our native speaking non-legal brethren, in 25 years of translating legal documents I don't recall this specific wording for this meaning. There are however a host of variants with the same meaning as shown in the answers.......

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Note added at 10 hrs (2015-07-10 18:59:46 GMT)
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I would go as far as to say that the intended meaning may in fact be that the amount of the liabilities cited will be unrestricted but on balance I would stick with this.



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Note added at 10 hrs (2015-07-10 19:00:08 GMT)
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I any event it is somewhat off-beat drafting.
Note from asker:
Hi, thanks for your input. And yet I have more than one native telling me that this definitely isn't the meaning so I don't know what to do!
Hi, thank you both for your help. My problem is that I now have more than one native person telling me that this isn't the meaning! So I really don't know what to do!
Apologies! I thought the previous note hadn't been submitted correctly.
I'm sorry if I've offended you but I think it would be unwise to completely disregard the opinion of native speakers here. Obviously the ideal solution would be to find somebody who is native but also has some degree of linguistic expertise to confirm it rather than trusting my "native friends" as you put it.
Yes, it did seem odd that I couldn't find any other examples of it online. Thanks again for all your help-in my panic and indecision (and perhaps misguided feelings about the importance of natives!) I didn't show the appropriate level of appreciation for your input and expertise. Please forgive me!
Peer comment(s):
agree Charles Davis : It certainly is the meaning. "Including without limitation" is quite commonly used, but personally I don't like it; it seems unclear to me.
1 hr
Thanx
agree philgoddard
3 hrs
Thanx
agree Andy Watkinson
4 hrs
Thanx
agree Henry Hinds : Absolutely. What is used in Spanish in my part of the world is "en forma ilustrativa y no limitativa" or "en forma ilustrativa sin limitaciones" and other similar versions.
6 hrs
sin ser exhaustiva is also common in Spain - Thanks Henry
agree Jesstee : native speaking "non-legal bretheren" ? Billh im very disapointed by this statement.
7 hrs
Thanx
agree Manuel Aburto : Concuerdo con Billh. Definitivamente esta seria la respuesta correcta. Otro sinonimo es "de forma enunciativa y no limitativa"
8 hrs
Thanx
agree bizisyl
8 hrs
Thanx
agree Yvonne Becker : Es una expresión muy común en patentes escritas originalmente en inglés y tiene el mismo propósito en este contexto
11 hrs
Gracias
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thank you!"
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