Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
commercialisé en ville
English translation:
sold on the public market
Added to glossary by
Laura Hastings-Brownstein
Mar 16, 2015 20:54
9 yrs ago
1 viewer *
French term
commercialisé en ville
French to English
Marketing
Medical (general)
in a lawsuit for Abusive Tactics of a Pharmaceutical Company
I have not been able to find a proper English translation for this term. I feel there are many possibilities and would appreciate any help you might be able to give me to help narrow the possibilities down.
The term is used to describe the type of marketing of a drug allowed for this pharmaceutical company. Here is some context:
« Article 1er : Il est établi que les sociétés XXXX France, en tant qu’auteur de la pratique, et YYYY, en sa qualité de société mère de XXXX France, ont enfreint les dispositions de l'article L. 420-2 du code de commerce ainsi que celles de l’article 102 du traité sur le fonctionnement de l’Union européenne, en mettant en oeuvre une pratique de dénigrement des génériques concurrents de (Brandname Drug) sur le marché français du (Generic Drug) **commercialisé en ville**.
Considérant qu'après avoir retenu que le marché pertinent était le marché français du (Brandname Drug) et ses génériques) commercialisé en ville et que la société XXXX s'y trouvait en position dominante, ...
Considérant qu’il n'est pas discuté que le marché pertinent est celui du (Generic Drug) **commercialisé en ville** sur le territoire français, ni que la société XXXX ait été. jusqu'à l'entrée des génériques sur ce marché au mois d’octobre 2009, ...
... que ces parts démontrent qu'au moment de l'ouverture à la concurrence du marché du (Generic Drug) **commercialisé en ville**, la société XXXX est demeurée un opérateur puissant face à une concurrence particulièrement atomisée ;
Thanks very much in advance!
Laura
The term is used to describe the type of marketing of a drug allowed for this pharmaceutical company. Here is some context:
« Article 1er : Il est établi que les sociétés XXXX France, en tant qu’auteur de la pratique, et YYYY, en sa qualité de société mère de XXXX France, ont enfreint les dispositions de l'article L. 420-2 du code de commerce ainsi que celles de l’article 102 du traité sur le fonctionnement de l’Union européenne, en mettant en oeuvre une pratique de dénigrement des génériques concurrents de (Brandname Drug) sur le marché français du (Generic Drug) **commercialisé en ville**.
Considérant qu'après avoir retenu que le marché pertinent était le marché français du (Brandname Drug) et ses génériques) commercialisé en ville et que la société XXXX s'y trouvait en position dominante, ...
Considérant qu’il n'est pas discuté que le marché pertinent est celui du (Generic Drug) **commercialisé en ville** sur le territoire français, ni que la société XXXX ait été. jusqu'à l'entrée des génériques sur ce marché au mois d’octobre 2009, ...
... que ces parts démontrent qu'au moment de l'ouverture à la concurrence du marché du (Generic Drug) **commercialisé en ville**, la société XXXX est demeurée un opérateur puissant face à une concurrence particulièrement atomisée ;
Thanks very much in advance!
Laura
Proposed translations
(English)
| 3 | sold in the general practice market |
Tony M
|
| 3 +3 | available at any High Street chemist/pharmacy |
Jennifer Levey
|
| 3 | commercial hub |
tanglsus
|
| 4 -1 | over the counter |
Francois Boye
|
References
| hint |
writeaway
|
| Hint? |
Ana Vozone
|
Change log
Mar 16, 2015 21:01: writeaway changed "Field" from "Law/Patents" to "Medical" , "Field (specific)" from "Law (general)" to "Medical (general)"
Mar 16, 2015 21:26: writeaway changed "Field" from "Medical" to "Marketing" , "Field (write-in)" from "Lawsuit for Abusive Tactics of a Pharmaceutical Company" to "in a lawsuit for Abusive Tactics of a Pharmaceutical Company"
Proposed translations
33 mins
Selected
sold in the general practice market
I'm not convinced this is the best term (still less the dedicated specialist term), but I do think it could be used in the register of your document.
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Note added at 40 minutes (2015-03-16 21:34:52 GMT)
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To answer W/A's perfectly valid point, with the problem being that we have only one half of the situation and hence can't draw the comparison "vs. what?", maybe 'retail market' would work better — at least, it covers the idea of 'available from chemist's', though I fear could also confuse the issue by suggesting the possibility of 'over-the-counter medicines'.
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Note added at 42 minutes (2015-03-16 21:36:25 GMT)
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But that's all part of the very specific mechanism of the French re-imbursement-based healthcare system, which has no direct parallel in th UK or US(?).
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Note added at 9 heures (2015-03-17 06:36:38 GMT)
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Of course, the medical sales reps doing this selling will be targeting GPs and other independent practitioners in their marketing efforts, in order to get them to prescribe THEIR drug in preference to the generic one.
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Note added at 2 jours56 minutes (2015-03-18 21:50:49 GMT) Post-grading
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I understand the solution you have chosen, but would advocate caution in aplying this in all contexts; the problem is, in EN, 'public' tends to oppose 'private' — and in the specific case of healthcare, we do also in France have 'dans le public / le privé'; now this is of course not the specific distinction bein made here; as if there were two kinds of drugs, ones for ordinary 'public' patients, and special ones for 'private' patients. This could be particularly ambiguous in your specific instance, tending to imply that 'generic' drugs were only suitable for the 'poor' people in the public sector, as against the more expensive branded drigs for the rich private patients!
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Note added at 40 minutes (2015-03-16 21:34:52 GMT)
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To answer W/A's perfectly valid point, with the problem being that we have only one half of the situation and hence can't draw the comparison "vs. what?", maybe 'retail market' would work better — at least, it covers the idea of 'available from chemist's', though I fear could also confuse the issue by suggesting the possibility of 'over-the-counter medicines'.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 42 minutes (2015-03-16 21:36:25 GMT)
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But that's all part of the very specific mechanism of the French re-imbursement-based healthcare system, which has no direct parallel in th UK or US(?).
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 9 heures (2015-03-17 06:36:38 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Of course, the medical sales reps doing this selling will be targeting GPs and other independent practitioners in their marketing efforts, in order to get them to prescribe THEIR drug in preference to the generic one.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 jours56 minutes (2015-03-18 21:50:49 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------
I understand the solution you have chosen, but would advocate caution in aplying this in all contexts; the problem is, in EN, 'public' tends to oppose 'private' — and in the specific case of healthcare, we do also in France have 'dans le public / le privé'; now this is of course not the specific distinction bein made here; as if there were two kinds of drugs, ones for ordinary 'public' patients, and special ones for 'private' patients. This could be particularly ambiguous in your specific instance, tending to imply that 'generic' drugs were only suitable for the 'poor' people in the public sector, as against the more expensive branded drigs for the rich private patients!
Note from asker:
| Hi Tony, Thanks! I am going to make this "on the public market" as I think that communicates the fact that it is not only sold to hospitals and other official institutions. |
| I don't think there is a good translation as the reference only pertains to the French system and has no equivalent in the US. I will explain this to the client so that they can be aware of the situation. Thanks very much for clarifying this point. |
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
writeaway
: it's about being available in pharmacies/chemists (drugs stores in USAese) or in a hospital environment (as you said). I don't really like the 'general practice market'./it's just the diff between meds for hospitals only or for retail chemists
3 mins
|
|
Quite agree, but I think it's the only short way to express the difference, given that we can't write a long explanation; OK, it will also include non-hospital specialists; but the FR health reimbursement scheme is too complex to explain here!
|
|
| neutral |
Jennifer Levey
: If you googlify "general practice market" you'll discover that it refers consistently to people vying to provide services as general practitioners (i.e., family doctors, etc.). Not a good choice in Asker's context.
21 mins
|
|
As we are all agreed, it is difficult to find one concise term in EN; but I think a variant of this could usefully be worked into Asker's context, perhaps avoiding that precise phrasing.
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thanks!"
35 mins
commercial hub
please see the link below for definition:
A commercial hub is referred to as the commercial focal point of a city, nation, or the region. As a commercial hub, it is expected to provide with the best of commercial facilities, act as a transit point and facilitate and enhance trade and commerce. All countries around the world have respective commercial hubs that help them to promote trade and cooperation amongst them selves as well as among the local people and commercial establishments
A commercial hub is referred to as the commercial focal point of a city, nation, or the region. As a commercial hub, it is expected to provide with the best of commercial facilities, act as a transit point and facilitate and enhance trade and commerce. All countries around the world have respective commercial hubs that help them to promote trade and cooperation amongst them selves as well as among the local people and commercial establishments
Reference:
+3
30 mins
Jennifer Levey
Chile
Chile
Native in English
Chile
Human-scale Globalization
Native in: English (Variant: British) 
Works in: Spanish to English, French to English, English to Spanish, and 2 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
12
available at any High Street chemist/pharmacy
The ST appears to refer to products are available at any High Street chemist or pharmacy.
But Asker has hinted in the discussion box that she needs something for the US. Does the US have 'High Streets', in the same way we have them in ther UK?
Branded and generic medicines - NetDoctor.co.uk
www.netdoctor.co.uk/medicines/brand_generic.htm
Jun 28, 2013 - They may be marketed either as generic sildenafil tablets, or under a ... All high-street pharmacists are obliged by law to dispense whatever the ...
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Note added at 31 mins (2015-03-16 21:25:57 GMT)
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More of the same (but different...):
Consuming Issues: Which chemist is cheapest: high street ...
www.independent.co.uk › Money › Spend & Save
May 8, 2010 - Boots came in the middle of both online and high street-shops. ... was justified because they had been designed, tested and sold in the UK.
Quality Issues in Clinical Genetic Services
https://books.google.cl/books?isbn=9048139198
Ulf Kristoffersson, Jörg Schmidtke, J. J. Cassiman - 2010 - Medical
Marketed? ... 1), which may be another company's website; an alternative healthcare provider; a sports centre, pharmacy or other high street store; or a private ...
Narcomania: A Journey Through Britain's Drug World
https://books.google.cl/books?isbn=1448136490
Max Daly, Steve Sampson - 2012 - Social Science
All were available legally and were sold in grocers, chemists and by street ... 'By the 1890s high-street pharmacies had become places of wonder,' says Mike lay ...
Evidence-based Pharmacy - Page 70 - Google Books Result
https://books.google.cl/books?isbn=0853694362
Christine Bond - 2000 - Medical
... what do they think about the role of the pharmacist in having a more interventionist paternalistic ... both based in medical premises and from the traditional high street base, the potential for ... GSL Ibuprofen product to be marketed this month.
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Note added at 1 hr (2015-03-16 21:57:02 GMT)
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Tony wrote (Note added under his answer at 40 minutes (2015-03-16 21:34:52 GMT)):
... at least, it covers the idea of 'available from chemist's', though I fear could also confuse the issue by suggesting the possibility of 'over-the-counter medicines'.
The simple answer to that 'problem' (if it is one...) is to include 'dispensing', as in:
available at any High Street dispensing chemist/pharmacy
That said, while we don't know what the drug is, and whether it is available 'under/over-the-counter' or only 'on prescription', this a a somewhat academic argument.
But Asker has hinted in the discussion box that she needs something for the US. Does the US have 'High Streets', in the same way we have them in ther UK?
Branded and generic medicines - NetDoctor.co.uk
www.netdoctor.co.uk/medicines/brand_generic.htm
Jun 28, 2013 - They may be marketed either as generic sildenafil tablets, or under a ... All high-street pharmacists are obliged by law to dispense whatever the ...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 31 mins (2015-03-16 21:25:57 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
More of the same (but different...):
Consuming Issues: Which chemist is cheapest: high street ...
www.independent.co.uk › Money › Spend & Save
May 8, 2010 - Boots came in the middle of both online and high street-shops. ... was justified because they had been designed, tested and sold in the UK.
Quality Issues in Clinical Genetic Services
https://books.google.cl/books?isbn=9048139198
Ulf Kristoffersson, Jörg Schmidtke, J. J. Cassiman - 2010 - Medical
Marketed? ... 1), which may be another company's website; an alternative healthcare provider; a sports centre, pharmacy or other high street store; or a private ...
Narcomania: A Journey Through Britain's Drug World
https://books.google.cl/books?isbn=1448136490
Max Daly, Steve Sampson - 2012 - Social Science
All were available legally and were sold in grocers, chemists and by street ... 'By the 1890s high-street pharmacies had become places of wonder,' says Mike lay ...
Evidence-based Pharmacy - Page 70 - Google Books Result
https://books.google.cl/books?isbn=0853694362
Christine Bond - 2000 - Medical
... what do they think about the role of the pharmacist in having a more interventionist paternalistic ... both based in medical premises and from the traditional high street base, the potential for ... GSL Ibuprofen product to be marketed this month.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2015-03-16 21:57:02 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Tony wrote (Note added under his answer at 40 minutes (2015-03-16 21:34:52 GMT)):
... at least, it covers the idea of 'available from chemist's', though I fear could also confuse the issue by suggesting the possibility of 'over-the-counter medicines'.
The simple answer to that 'problem' (if it is one...) is to include 'dispensing', as in:
available at any High Street dispensing chemist/pharmacy
That said, while we don't know what the drug is, and whether it is available 'under/over-the-counter' or only 'on prescription', this a a somewhat academic argument.
Note from asker:
| One thing to note, this is US English. Sorry I did not mention that before. |
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Tony M
: Although that corresponds in part to my understanding (as mention in the discussion box), I don't really feel this would quite fit the register of Asker's very formal context. I don't believe 'High Street' is used with the same sense in AE.
4 mins
|
| agree |
writeaway
: In USAese the term is drug stores /retail drugstores. As opposed to being available to hospitals only.
9 mins
|
|
'drug store' - Oops! Of course! Thanks.
|
|
| agree |
mchd
: d'accord avec writeaway, c'est le même principe en France
27 mins
|
| agree |
Rachel Fell
: any high street chemist (i.e. no capitals)
1 hr
|
-1
2 hrs
Francois Boye
United States
United States
Native in French
United States
An economic geek with social skills
Native in: French 
Works in: English to French, French to English, Spanish to English, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
13
over the counter
This is the typical expression used by the medical profession in the US
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Over-the-counter_drug
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Note added at 3 hrs (2015-03-17 00:28:12 GMT)
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over the counter = available in any pharmacy to all without medical prescription
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Over-the-counter_drug
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2015-03-17 00:28:12 GMT)
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over the counter = available in any pharmacy to all without medical prescription
Note from asker:
| No, this is not correct. Over the counter drugs are drugs sold without a prescription and this drug is sold only with prescription. I did not reveal the name of the medication in my excerpt for privacy reasons, but it is not an over the counter (OTC) drug. Thanks! |
Peer comment(s):
| disagree |
Tony M
: That would be dangerously incorrect! Although some OTC medicines might possibly be covered by this term, that isn't what its underlying meaning is.
6 hrs
|
Reference comments
33 mins
Reference:
hint
<bL>e choix du lieu de mise sur le marché est également lié au fait qu'il existe une autre chaînede détermination, qui lie le lieu de dispensation
à deux types distincts de prise en charge. Lors qu'il est consommé à l'hôpital, le médicament est pris en charge par la dotation globale hospit
alière, tandis qu'en ville, il est remboursé par les caisses d'assurance maladie (8). Ces deux régimes ont leurs inconvénients. À l'hôpital,
l'évolution de la dotation globale hospitalière est encadrée par un taux directeur limitatif et les budgets consacrés au médicament sont d'autant
plus contraints que les deux tiers des dépenseshospitalières sont absorbés par les charges de personnels. En ville, le prix du médicament est
fixé par les pouvoirs publics.
Part of a PDF. Now I can't find the url........
à deux types distincts de prise en charge. Lors qu'il est consommé à l'hôpital, le médicament est pris en charge par la dotation globale hospit
alière, tandis qu'en ville, il est remboursé par les caisses d'assurance maladie (8). Ces deux régimes ont leurs inconvénients. À l'hôpital,
l'évolution de la dotation globale hospitalière est encadrée par un taux directeur limitatif et les budgets consacrés au médicament sont d'autant
plus contraints que les deux tiers des dépenseshospitalières sont absorbés par les charges de personnels. En ville, le prix du médicament est
fixé par les pouvoirs publics.
Part of a PDF. Now I can't find the url........
Peer comments on this reference comment:
| agree |
Tony M
2 mins
|
| agree |
mchd
25 mins
|
| agree |
Daryo
: http://www.persee.fr/web/revues/home/prescript/article/estat... go to page 75
8 hrs
|
2 hrs
Ana Vozone
Will do!
Native in: Portuguese (Variant: European/Portugal)
Works in: English to Portuguese, French to Portuguese, German to Portuguese, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
15
Discussion
Could be sold in a supermarket if no prescription is required, could be sold anywhere - not necessarily in a high street nor even in a town (could be a rural pharmacy).
However, I can't offhand think of a special term used for that in EN.
Oh I see! No, it's not really literally 'in towns' (though that may be part of it); it's more about 'in the community' versus 'within the world of hospitals'. Cf. médecine de ville = (roughly) general practice, and other usages such as 'tenue de ville' = 'street / smart / business dress' or more specifically 'lounge suite'. Other similar uses include 'imprimerie de ville' = 'jobbing printer', and cf. the notion in the UK of 'the High Street banks' (very much not 'the City banks'!).