Comunican (asker) Jun 27, 2019:

@Charles Davis I agree with much of what you say and especially take your point about "false positives"! Thanks for engaging and your helpful insights.

Charles Davis Jun 27, 2019:

At the risk of stating the obvious, I've always argued that one of the most important things a translator has to do all the time is read. You don't always feel like it when you spend all your working day with texts, but it's vital. Read genuine English texts, of all kinds, written by competent native speakers; don't just look things up in them but read them. If you translate art catalogues, read genuine English art catalogues to get a feel for how they express themselves. If you translate medical articles, read articles by literate English-speaking medics (most scientific articles are written in non-native English, so you have to be very careful). And if you translate health and safety, read health and safety documentation written by people who have no idea that Spanish talks about "medidas preventivas". If you find, as you do, that they talk a lot about "preventive measures" or "risk prevention measures", you can be pretty confident that it's OK, I would argue.

Charles Davis Jun 27, 2019:

As for EU-speak, well it's fine for the EU official purposes but often to be used with care in other contexts.

Charles Davis Jun 27, 2019:

@Comunican I can relate to that completely, and I agree that constant vigilance to avoid falling mechanically into unnatural literal translation is a vital part of our job. I do feel, on the other hand, that our antennae can become over-sensitive and sometimes throw up "false positives". Avoidance of literal translation is a natural tendency for translators, not least (I would argue) because when clients see a literal translation they think it can't be any good, because any fool could have done it. Knowing when being literal is best is also a vital skill.

Spanish is absolutely peppered with unnatural calques of English expressions (as are other languages) for the obvious reason that people deal with so many texts badly translated from English. It's less common, however, for unnatural literal English translations of Spanish expressions to creep into common use, except, I suppose, among translators. That, of course, is why it's so important to take great pains to ensure that the examples one uses from the Internet to support a particular English usage are genuine English, "uncontaminated" by contact with another language. It's often not obvious until you look carefully.

Comunican (asker) Jun 27, 2019:

@Charles Davis "Needless to say, literal translations can also be inappropriate!" I agree that both literal translations can be appropriate and inappropriate.
However, it's a hobby horse of mine to challenge/weed out terms that are not "natural" in English and that have become standard simply by overuse. It's a bit like that saying "a lie doesn't become a truth if you keep repeating it". I see a lot of those types of terms in EU and academic documents. A good example is "movilidades" for universities, to refer to Erasmus exchanges, placements abroad and so on - "mobilities" sits badly with me, but it does appear to now be a common term in the UK. Even so, I couldn't bring myself to use it (!), so plumped for Billhill's very helpful other options (mobility opportunities, mobility activities, or mobility programmes). Like I say, it is a hobby horse of mine :-)

Comunican (asker) Jun 27, 2019:

@Stuart and Aida Nelson "I think the asker means 'preventive measures' being a translatorism in the sense of it being a literal translation of the term without further thought" - that's exactly what I meant.

Charles Davis Jun 25, 2019:

Needless to say, literal translations can also be inappropriate!

Charles Davis Jun 25, 2019:

@Aida Do you mean "health and safety measures" is the standard term used in the UK? So it is, and so is preventive measures: they are roughly equally common in the documentation of the Health and Safety Executive, and elsewhere. The point I wanted to insist on is that while all (occupational) preventive measures are health and safety measures, not all health and safety measures are preventive measures. They are not synonyms, so "health and safety measures" is not, in principle, an accurate translation of "medidas preventivas".

I'm sure that is what Comunican meant by "translatorism". But a literal translation can be accurate, appropriate and idiomatic, with or without further thought. Efforts to avoid literal translations simply because they are literal give rise to a lot of inaccuracies.

Stuart and Aida Nelson Jun 25, 2019:

health & safety measures Last month, I interpreted for the training of engineers on how to use a machine in a warehouse. The company's Health and Safety Officer also took part in the training. He was asking of sort of questions on how a possible error would cause an accident, etc. IMO, 'health and safety' is the standard term used in the UK. I think the asker means 'preventive measures' being a translatorism in the sense of it being a literal translation of the term without further thought.

Charles Davis Jun 25, 2019:

But the main point to me is that HSW is broader than occupational risk prevention. Not all H&S measures are preventive measures. Installing fire extinguishers is an obvious example. Another is first-aid kits and defribillators, etc.

Charles Davis Jun 25, 2019:

translatorism? Not so, I think; HSE docs are full of refs to preventive measures.

Robert Forstag Jun 25, 2019:

My opinion There is nothing wrong here with “preventive measures.”