Glossary entry (derived from question below)
Russian term or phrase:
станковое искусство
English translation:
fine art (in some contexts)
- The asker opted for community grading. The question was closed on 2017-09-03 20:54:08 based on peer agreement (or, if there were too few peer comments, asker preference.)
Aug 31, 2017 11:13
6 yrs ago
Russian term
станковое искусство
Russian to English
Art/Literary
Art, Arts & Crafts, Painting
visual art
Dear all,
I know that "станковое искусство" and "станковая живопись" already appear in Proz discussions, but I'm not happy with the solutions offered. People keep translating it as "easel painting", but I never saw the expression in an English original. "Станковое искусство" means a kind of "art as art", i.e. neither utilitarian nor purely decorative, and it is limited to objects (paintings, sculptures...), not performances/events etc. It is often used slightly derogatorily, "станковое искусство, unlike our cool modern project work..." Still, it's not quite the same as "traditional". What do you think? thank you!
Russian wiki explanation: https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Станковое_искусство
I know that "станковое искусство" and "станковая живопись" already appear in Proz discussions, but I'm not happy with the solutions offered. People keep translating it as "easel painting", but I never saw the expression in an English original. "Станковое искусство" means a kind of "art as art", i.e. neither utilitarian nor purely decorative, and it is limited to objects (paintings, sculptures...), not performances/events etc. It is often used slightly derogatorily, "станковое искусство, unlike our cool modern project work..." Still, it's not quite the same as "traditional". What do you think? thank you!
Russian wiki explanation: https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Станковое_искусство
Proposed translations
(English)
4 +1 | Fine art vs. decorative art | The Misha |
4 | easel painting | Olga Kuderova |
4 -1 | Self-contained/self consistent art | Andrey Maksimov |
2 | (visual) art for art's sake | Frank Szmulowicz, Ph. D. |
Proposed translations
+1
1 hr
Selected
Fine art vs. decorative art
Susan is right (she's always right:)), that's simply not how we think of art in the English-speaking world. The primary dichotomy is between fine art (what Frank called "art for art's sake" although this is not what they actually call it) and decorative art. These are very loose and conflicting labels, to be sure, but that's all there is. Here's an article that discusses the difference btw the two and the problems inherent in using these labels: http://reddotblog.com/ask-a-gallery-owner-fine-art-vs-decora...
There is yet another dichotomy, figurative vs. non-figurative, but that's not at issue here. In any case, it matters none to an English speaker whether a painting was created on an easel or someone's kitchen table. This "easel painting" just doesn't mean anything to anyone who is not professionally dealing with Russian art-related literature and such.
I said it before and will keep on saying it until the day I retire to greener pastures: things are often perceived and worded differently in different languages. Russian is HUUUUUGE on giving everything its "proper" label and putting it into its assigned little box, hence the outright disgusting proliferation of all kinds of pseudo-scientific classifications and terminology where other languages happily do without. English, on the other hand, favors verbs - i.e. labels for actions rather than things. Different national psychologies, perhaps?
There is yet another dichotomy, figurative vs. non-figurative, but that's not at issue here. In any case, it matters none to an English speaker whether a painting was created on an easel or someone's kitchen table. This "easel painting" just doesn't mean anything to anyone who is not professionally dealing with Russian art-related literature and such.
I said it before and will keep on saying it until the day I retire to greener pastures: things are often perceived and worded differently in different languages. Russian is HUUUUUGE on giving everything its "proper" label and putting it into its assigned little box, hence the outright disgusting proliferation of all kinds of pseudo-scientific classifications and terminology where other languages happily do without. English, on the other hand, favors verbs - i.e. labels for actions rather than things. Different national psychologies, perhaps?
Note from asker:
We're having a real conversation on art here; such a pity it's not in my living room! Thank you:) |
Peer comment(s):
agree |
Susan Welsh
: Sounds good to me. (And Susan is always right ... except when she's wrong!)
37 mins
|
Yeah, but who is counting?:)
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "thank you!"
5 mins
easel painting
станковая живопись или станковое искусство выполняется на мольберте easel
Note from asker:
Это я понимаю.:) Но увы. Скульптура -- это тоже станковое искусство. И, главное, выражения этого англ. искусствоведы не знают. |
Dear Olga, actually "easel painting" is used much more than I thought, thank you for making this clear to me! Still, in this case I was looking for something different... |
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
Susan Welsh
: Did you read Asker's question? She specifically does not want this translation.
4 mins
|
neutral |
The Misha
: Any painting "выполняется на мольберте easel" - unless it's a fresco or a mural, or your name is Jackson Pollock. That's not the point.
1 hr
|
21 mins
(visual) art for art's sake
"Art for art's sake" is the usual English rendering of a French slogan from the early 19th century, "l'art pour l'art", and expresses a philosophy that the intrinsic value of art, and the only "true" art, is divorced from any didactic, moral, or utilitarian function. Such works are sometimes described as "autotelic", from the Greek autoteles, "complete in itself", a concept that has been expanded to embrace "inner-directed" or "self-motivated" human beings.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_for_art's_saI
I added visual as opposed to performance arts.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_for_art's_saI
I added visual as opposed to performance arts.
Note from asker:
Thank you! I'll wait for more answers, but this is really helpful. I think I'll go for art for art's sake, traditional art and some other variations depending on the context... |
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
Susan Welsh
: This phrase has a distinctly negative connotation to me. E.g. https://www.jstor.org/stable/25587887?seq=1#page_scan_tab_co...
18 mins
|
The Asker specifically requested a term that might be viewed by some as pejorative. Looks like "art for art's sake" fills the bill. As in art, it is in the eye of the beholder.
|
-1
7 hrs
Self-contained/self consistent art
Peer comment(s):
disagree |
Susan Welsh
: It's not English.
10 mins
|
Thank you, Susan. It is not surprising. Alas, English is not my mother tongue (no sarcasm from my part). I was trying to express my point of view on the above Russian reference.
|
Discussion